from DailyKos
The liberal Web site Daily Kos, hoping to “make mischief for the Republican Party – and bolster the Democrats’ chances for taking the White House” – is urging Democrats in Michiagn to cross over and vote for Mitt Romney in Tuesday’s state primary.
It’s a classic dirty trick, but perfectly legal. And while Machiavellian political ploys of this sort rarely work, the author’s logic is thus:
A Romney victory in Michigan will keep him in the presidential race. And the more candidates slugging it out among the Republicans, the better for the Democrats.
John McCain is riding high after his resounding win in the New Hampshire primary Tuesday, and Mike Huckabee’s star is still shining following his Iowa win. With South Carolina posing an opportunity for either candidate to continue the momentum, Romney needs to win in his native Michigan to stay competitive.
The former Massachusetts governor is already spending almost all his time there, and he repeatedly says he’s going to win.
Says the Kos, “And we want Romney in, because the more Republican candidates we have fighting it out, trashing each other with negative ads and spending tons of money, the better it is for us. We want Mitt to stay in the race, and to do that, we need him to win in Michigan.”
This is absurd, why cant we all get along? Koskovians can be blamed, at least in part, for global warming with all the hot air they emit. This story has some interesting implications – and most have been gone over in other posts so I wont bore you here. Just remember, We are in this together.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Brett,
You should add the link to that story on this front page, here it is:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1/10/2713/87225/55/434206
January 11th, 2008 at 12:10 pm
The funny thing is Kos is also on record as saying the GOP candidate he’d least like to face in the general election is Mitt Romney.
It’s important to note Romney’s electability isn’t the issue in Kos’ reasoning – it’s that he wants a long, drawn out primary with as many candidates as possible.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:11 pm
this isn’t a Romney thing, because they are attacking Mike too – this is a Republican thing..
January 11th, 2008 at 12:11 pm
I think this will have the opposite effect, it will drive alot of GOPers out to vote for McCain if they think the liberals are trying to take advantage of the system. Republicans are smart, Liberals play stupid stuff like this.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:11 pm
Bet there will be more of these kinds of things from those sneaky dems!! LOL
January 11th, 2008 at 12:13 pm
Sounds good to me!
January 11th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
#4. . . I don’t know about that. If you’re a Michigan Republican and you care enough about this, you would have been voting anyway. And if you’re voting, I doubt you would switch candidates from your guy to McCain based on a dumb liberal campaign trick.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:16 pm
#4 JL,
“I think this will have the opposite effect, it will drive alot of GOPers out to vote for McCain if they think the liberals are trying to take advantage of the system”
McCain’s only hope is that the independents in the state vote for him, there is no way he beats Romney if only republicans are voting. Why would I, as a Romney supporter, vote for McCain? Even if the Dems picked Huckabee I’d still vote for Romney, it makes no sense for any republican to change their vote, that truely plays into the dirty trick the Dems are playing.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:17 pm
Everyone is underestimating Romney’s negatives. he has the highest unfavorability ratings – this lowers his ceiling in MI and other states.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:17 pm
This is different than the actual democratic chairmen asking their voters to vote for a particular GOP candidate. I also read the story where the Obama and Edwards groups are asking the MI supporters to vote uncommited in the democratic race there. So, the democratic voters in Michigan are being asked to vote three different ways already?
January 11th, 2008 at 12:25 pm
Whatever it takes to get Mitt a win. Is it an ideal win, no, but it is a win. I’ll take it.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:29 pm
11, come on now, if i posted the one where the groups are helping Huckabee, you be screaming foul.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:31 pm
As I said in another post, this could backfire on the Dems, should they try this. Many voters in MI are distressed auto workers, who Romney appeals to. They may have been thinking about voting for him anyway, and this is the push they need.
Having said this, how many of the primary voters actually read Kos, and how many actually go out of their way to participate in a scheme like this? I don’t think it would be all that many.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:33 pm
they are at least right in strategy though. A Mitt win in Michigan would be a catalyst to a drag out four, maybe six month battle for the GOP nod.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
One state isn’t going to throw the election into a contested convention. There’s still 30-odd primaries after MI.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:37 pm
This would be poetic justice, since it was liberal independents crossing over in the Republican primary in New Hampshire to vote for McCain that cost Romney New Hampshire. The irony there was that they felt they could afford to do that because, according to the pollsters, Obama was headed for an easy win. Double Irony: It cost Obama New Hampshire and resuscitated the Clintons, who were on life support prior to the reprieve.
If the independent and Democrats cancel each other out in Michigan, Mitt will win, because he will take the Republican vote in the supposedly Republican primary.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
tottaly unrelated, but a funny link from craigs list. all the candidates as they relate to star wars characters.
http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/sfo/526482501.html?article=main
January 11th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
alaska jake,
If Mitt were to win Michigan, he is already poised to win Nevada, and not badly positioned in South Carolina. If he wins Michigan, it takes away McCain’s momentum and perhaps gives him the momentum he needs to win South Carolina. In other words, Michigan could trigger a belated Romney surge that could provide a speedy resolution to the nomination process. This is wishful thinking at this point, since a wide open primary in Michigan is a deck stacked against the true conservative in the race, but keep an eye on it.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:45 pm
Liberal are already choosing the republican nominee or anybody think that the McCain resurrection is a republican phenomenum?…….Is better that democrats vote in republican primaries voting for a real repubs and not voting for a fake conservative because that’s what John McCain is a fake conservative and a fake republican.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
I’ll take it!!
Maybe now the Dems will get something right once in their lives by voting for Romney. Heck even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while. Go Mitt!! Nice endorsements today!!
January 11th, 2008 at 12:47 pm
I just don’t think average primary voters do this sort of thing. Even when Indies (and I suppose Dems) vote in a GOP primary, most of them (like most of us) vote their concience, not out of some diabolical scheme to throw the GOP race into hysterics. The vast majority of all voters in all parties take voting, and their own vote, quite seriously.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
How did all this even come about in Michigan anyway? Who’s brilliant idea was it to allow opposing party members to vote in the GOP race? How (or why) is this even legal?
January 11th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
I don’t see Mitt having much of a chance in MI because of the Dem ticket is so screwed up. I would be surprised to see Mitt do better than 3rd — and I’m a staunch Romney supporter. It is rather annoying that the independents and even Dems will have so much say in who the Republican nominee is this time around.
How come no polls for over a month coming out of Nevada? I believe that is the must win state for Romney. SC will likely be a repeat of IA, and with MI probably going to McCain, NV is really where we need to see what is happening.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
21, alaska
My thoughts exactly.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:50 pm
The current Republican situation in terms of voter preference, is about as stable as the weather lately. The fact that a block of indie’s in NH can change the race so much really says alot. McCain who was basically unelectable 2 months ago, is now the front runner because of the chain reaction which caused a perfect storm. Huckabee set it off by being born with (evangelical silver spoon in the mouth) start on 2nd base in Iowa. Now McCain is the flavor of the week until someone comes along and wins another primary. If Thompson already had some wind in his sail,he would probably be a lock in SC, with his great “meet the virgins” quip last night. It seems that the best one liners still get alot of mileage of late. I’m convinced if Huckabee hadn’t gotten his “Jesus was too smart to run for office” line off, we wouldn’t be here today discussing McCain or Huckabee for that matter. So if you still think the process works,I agree with you. Only because the CONSTITUTION works. Our lame reasons for electing officials in general remains just that,lame. Only a relativly small percentage of the electorate don’t fall into the “bandwagon” traps laid by candidates. Huckabee is by far the worse offender in that category, followed closely by the drive by media. Those salivating dogs are the biggest threat to democracy today. But again thank God for the CONSTITUTION which protects the coutry from itself. It truly was inspired by God, and is the only saving grace at times. I shudder at supporting any candidate when my opinion is only as valid as the media will allow, and in the end my participation in the process is minimized because of the swooning media watching public.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:51 pm
The reason there is an open primary is because the Mccain folks fought hard to preserve it. MI GOP wanted to change it to closed but the mccain folks stopped it. Tells you alot about the man.
January 11th, 2008 at 12:56 pm
#26. . . But how did it come about to begin with? McCain fought to keep an existing open primary open. Why create a primary open to outside parties in the first place? I understand (but oppose) the logic of allowing Indy voters to choose a party primary (although I think they should have to register under that party, as they do here in Alaska, rather than be allowed to remain an Independent). But why ever allow Dems to vote in a GOP primary?
January 11th, 2008 at 12:59 pm
BTW, The repubs are just McCain’s latest dead sticks. And he so eloquently puts it, he know alot about tailspins. His legacy (along with Huckabee)will be to have broken up the best best political coalition this country has ever seen. Hats off to “the sheriff”, lol
January 11th, 2008 at 1:01 pm
If Huck or McCain get the nominee, I will no longer consider myself a Republican. A conservative, always, but I will no longer be a Republican, and not because I have left the party, but because the party has left me.
I suppose I will have to change my pseudonym though . . .
January 11th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
*nominee = nomination
January 11th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
Liberals and moderates hoisted McCain to a win in NH . . . what sweet justice it would be to hand McCain a loss by the same manner.
Funny stuff.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:05 pm
This Dem “strategy” means absolutely nothing. About 6 people will change their vote to Romney because of this, as much as I want it to be otherwise.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
“McCain’s only hope is that the independents in the state vote for him, there is no way he beats Romney if only republicans are voting.” McCain won the Republican vote in New Hampshire, and I could see him doing it again.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:06 pm
If Romney wins Michigan, I think McCain is dead. That will leave Romney and Huckabee to fight for this thing. (Yeah, Yeah, Giuliani, late state strategy blah blah). Then it will be a war for the soul of the party.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:07 pm
Kos’s strategy noted, I live in Michigan. And the word I hear from some Democrat friends is that they plan on voting undecided in the Democrat ticket not cross-over. They can’t write in a candidate without spoiling their ballot so they are hoping that a strong showing of “undecideds” would show that Hillary would not have won if the otehrs ere on the ticket. I’m guessing that even if Kos manages to convince some to cross-over more will take this approoach so their vote has some meaning for their own party.
Just my two cents.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:09 pm
Spunky,
I’m pretty sure you’re right. And centrists and those that are center left would cast their vote for McCain over “Let’s Move In God We Trust To The Front Of The Coin” Romney.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:09 pm
#32. . . True, but NH Republicans are generally more moderate and liberal than Michigan’s. I don’t think the two states are comparable.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:10 pm
How did Hillary end up as the only ticket on the Dem side anyway? That has never been adequately explained to me.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:10 pm
Kos and his ilk couldn’t even propel Ned Lemont to victory in CT in their own primary and in 2006 .
January 11th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
(#37 was a response to #33.)
January 11th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
Even though it probably isn’t about electability and is more about a drawn-out race, many Democrats do think Romney is unelectable. They better be careful. In 1980 Democrats were hoping Ronald Reagan would be the nominee because they thought he was too conservative to win a general election. He wound up winning 44 states, and Mitt will win almost that many this November. Be careful what you wish for Democrats!
January 11th, 2008 at 1:12 pm
#38. . . This is what I’m asking as well. I don’t get the whole MI primary concept. Plus, if it’s so convoluted on both sides, why is is so important to everyone?
January 11th, 2008 at 1:13 pm
i gotta say i agree with this url:
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2008/01/11/abcs-stephanopoulos-labels-fred-thompson-hit-man
January 11th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
Nice new mccain ad! It worked in NH, it’ll work again!
http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2008/01/new_ad_michigan_newspapers_back_mccain.php
January 11th, 2008 at 1:16 pm
#42. I agree. A win for McCain in MI would seem more meaningless to me given the situation, than people are claiming Romney’s win in WY was. This is a completely flawed primary. I’m just hoping Romney keeps it close enough to keep his delegate count up.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:17 pm
#38
All the candidates agreed to ditch Michigan as a penalty for the early primary.
Hillary said she is still ditching the place by not campaigning there even though she went through the motion to get her name on the ballot.
Great Principles, eh?
January 11th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Dems are backing Huckster too:
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080109/NEWS06/801090310
January 11th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
#43. . . haha Leave it to a former Clinton aide to promote a campaign conspiracy theory!
I also think it’s funny that when there are no sparks in a debate it’s derided as boring and uninformative, and when there are sparks candidates get labelled as “hit man.” Guess you can’t please everyone.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
“This would be poetic justice, since it was liberal independents crossing over in the Republican primary in New Hampshire to vote for McCain that cost Romney New Hampshire.”
Wrong, wrong wrong! McCain beat Romney among Republicans as well as independents. The latter turned the race from a narrow win to a comfortable won, but he STILL would have won. And there is a huge difference between independants voting in the Republican primary (Dems can’t do so in NH, you know) because you think he is the best choice of all the candidates and Dems voting in a Republican Primary because they want to face off against a weaker candidate, and the Kossaks who pubished this diary are very explicit in their goal.
And, again, for the 1000th time, if Romney was 1/2 the brilliant politician you Rombots say he was he should have won half the vote in the Primary. NHers know about his record better than anyone in the country, save Mass voters, and they voted accordingly. This man is NOT a good candidate and would NOT make a good President.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
In 2000, the Dems did the exact same thing (voting against the Republican
front runner which in 2000 meant voting for McCain), but it did not have the same
impact as Tuesday’s primary will. Either Huckabee or Romney will win this
primary, effectively ending McCain’s momentum. Michigan will be to 2008
what South Carolina was to 2000.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/news/aa022100a.htm?terms=government+michigan
And there’s nothing any of us can do about it. The Democrats will not listen
to reason, their only motive is to express their hatred for Republicans. And
they hate McCain for helping to win the war in Iraq.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
Actually if Romney wins MI it will be the loser between McCain and Huckabee for South Carolina that is dead.
1. If Romney wins MI either McCain or Huck are dead after SC.
2. the winner of SC (Huck or McCain) will join Romney and Guliani in FL (assuming Romney wins MI.
Guliani will barely win FL and Romney takes Feb 5th states with his momentus win from NV and MI. (either way guliani is dying.)
3. If Romney loses to McCain in MI then McCain will take out Huck in SC and Huck is dead and then McCain v. Guliani in FL and Guliani can win Feb 5th states b/c Romneys supporters will FLOCK to Guliani.
4. If McCain wins MI but Huck wins SC then Huck Guliani and McCain all fight in FL and Chaos reigns in Feb 5th and Who knows.
This is my analysis of the race
January 11th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
#38, Michigan is being punished for daring to move their primary to an earlier date. As a result most of the Dems pulled out of the primary. Hillary didn’t.
Right now Michigan Dems are all pretty scattered. First of all they are angry about the punishment. They want to know who the h#ll decided that NH and Iowa had to be first and why any outsiders should tell them when to hold their primary. As a result they are really ticked at the Dems.
The Dems I know are going one of three ways (this was before the Koz thing):
1) Vote uncommitted.
2) Vote for the Republican they would rather win if one had to.
3) Vote for Ron Paul just to jerk the party around.
I actually don’t think the Koz plan will do much. Unless the news stations pick it up most of the voting population (usually older) don’t go on line for their political news.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:33 pm
you can thank mccain for this open primary. his people have been fighting for it for three years now.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:38 pm
I’m glad to see that the Kremlin is giving out bad orders. I was afraid that the Kos and others would urge their people to vote for Huck or McCain. This is the prime example of idiotic liberals doing exactly what we want them to do…give us the best nominee. I was afraid that democrats in my state would vote for people who are bad for the republican party- instead they may help us to overcome McCain and his cheating little way of obtaining the “republican nomination” by getting dems and indies to vote. This gives me a lot more hope! Thanks crazy libs!!!
January 11th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Brett,
How come you weren’t saying we were all in this together when Huck was taking cheap shots at Mitt in the first NH debate and Ed Rollins said he wanted to punch mitt’s teeth out?
January 11th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
Here is a great article describing how Romney is starting to pick up steam in MI!!
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/01/11/571676.aspx
January 11th, 2008 at 1:43 pm
29 Colorodo Republican: I am feeling the same way after this primary. Thanks for putting it out there.
January 11th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
The supreme irony of this is that McCain fought hard to keep Michigan an open
primary. This will be his undoing. I don’t say this because I dislike John McCain.
We can all thank him that the Republicans have any chance at all in November by
sticking to his guns on Iraq. But the irony just kills me.
January 11th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
I can guarantee one thing. If Romney does manage to prevail in Michigan, the MSM
coverage will seem like a funeral service.
January 11th, 2008 at 2:19 pm
If Romney wins Michigan, the nomination is his to lose again. Interesting, McCain needs this more than Romney does.
January 11th, 2008 at 2:41 pm
As a Romney supporter, I don’t like this at all. Of course, I don’t like the independents giving it to McCain when the Republicans will be heavily Romney either. However, if its going to be done, I’d rather it be done such that Mitt gets the votes rather than someone else.
January 11th, 2008 at 3:09 pm
[...] Romney victory in Michigan will keep him in the race. The more candidates duking it out for the GOP nod increases the probability of a Democrat [...]
January 11th, 2008 at 3:26 pm
The DailyKos has one of the most overblown reputations out there. If memory serves, only one candidate they have endorsed has won. That was the guy running against Lieberman. He won the primary. However, it was a pyhretic victory in many ways because (a)Lieberman won the election anyway, (b)it forced Lieberman out of the Democratic party, (c)it gave Liberman veto power on their attempts to pull out of Iraq.
January 11th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
My enemy’s enemy is my friend! So, Brett, how is that somehow less moral or fair than the Huck/McCaine/Giuliani cabal vs. Romney. Just karma, I guess.
January 11th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
“Kos and his ilk couldn’t even propel Ned Lemont to victory in CT in their own primary and in 2006″
Huh? Ned Lamont won the primary.
And Dems still control that seat, since Joe caucuses with Dems.
Worked out just fine for the Kossacks.
“The DailyKos has one of the most overblown reputations out there. If memory serves, only one candidate they have endorsed has won”
You got a pretty bad memory. Doesnt seem to even go back as far as 2006!
The Kossacks were very vocal in pushing the progressive alternatives in many races – like John Tester in MT for example, who beat the Dem establishment candidate in the primary, and won the general.
re. Lamont “However, it was a pyhretic victory in many ways because (a)Lieberman won the election anyway, (b)it forced Lieberman out of the Democratic party, (c)it gave Liberman veto power on their attempts to pull out of Iraq.”
Huh? So what that Joe won the general? He still sits with the Dems. And forcing him out of the party was the whole point! And it didnt give him any more of a veto power than he would have had if they had not taken him on. What are you thinking?
January 11th, 2008 at 7:37 pm
Thought you might like to know details about a robo-call just received by me in Ypsilanti, Michigan, approx. 8:15 PM, today the 10th. I was unable to write down a complete transcript of the call, but it was clearly pro-Huckabee and anti-Romney. In push-poll format, it gave me the lowdown on the two candidates. Huckabee wants my taxes lower, and supported the Bush tax cuts, while Romney is apparently out to tax me to support illegal immigrants in “sanctuary cities”. It mentioned the immigration issue the most, mentioning the Minutemen organization endorsing Huckabee twice. It also brought up “the Clinton gun ban laws” and asked if I supported them. After saying no (to make sure I heard what came next), it said Romney endorsed these gun-grabbing laws, but that Huckabee not only didn’t endorse them, but was a “life-long hunter” and has a concealed carry permit. That was the weirdest part. Gun control is one thing, but apparently I was supposed to be reassured because Huck is *personally* packin’ heat.
January 11th, 2008 at 8:43 pm
I think Kos is just looking for an excuse to vote his conscience.